Maslow 4, A Belts Life

After reading the countless posts about belt jams and seeing the endless carnage from the picture I decided to investigate the current design. I have dealt with current sensing closed loops before with some of our assemblies at my work and it certainly sounds like we are having false current spikes due to unwanted resistance somewhere in the design.

The first place I looked was the spool because when I was assembling it i noticed i could not roll up the full length of timing belt without significant interference with the idler gear. You can see the the overlap in the image below.

There could be almost 2 belt thicknesses being squeezed in between there once assembled and driven via the electronic.

Next issue is the belt finding its way between gears and essentially killing itself. With most timing belt applications its highly suggested to use pully flanges to keep the belt from traveling outside the pulley track. The current design does a pretty good job of sandwiching the belt however those last few coils end up not being supported on the top and bottom. I think they might be getting loose and falling between the gears.

image

Unfortunately the proposed solution is not the easiest to modify, it will involve the changing of some major components, but lets get into it. All modified parts or surfaces below will be in RED.

First off lets make some more room for the coiled belt, to do this i will try and remove the hub of the idler gear, easier said then done, the gears are very hard. By doing this the more belt can coil without interference.

Too capture the belt better i propose we add a flange to the space between the gear and spool surface, its modeled as a single piece below but im working on a disc that can press over the gear profile and seat fully in the same position, that should be an easy addition that can be 3D printed with no major modification. This flange also captures the idler gear and prevents it from falling off the idler post.

Seems to have the perfect amount of clearance already also, but the flange addon can be thinned if needed.

Now comes the major modification section, still thinking of a way to make an add on, so it doesn’t have to be completely remade. In order to capture the other side of the belt we need to increase the diameter of the arm body some. Gluing an extension on might not be robust enough but could work, i will probably 3D print it at work to try it out.

From there some material will need to be removed from this feature to clear the other arm.

As of this moment, last step is to modify the belt guard for any interference and i really think the belt guard needs to create a single channel for the belt to travel through and not allow the belt to spread out/snake about within the arm assembly, i will take a crack at this lastly.

More to come…

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why do you need to add diameter below the gear teeth? (which is why you need to modify the arm)

If it was just these last couple layers of belt, the easy answer is to cut them off if your frame isn’t so large that you need them. Bar added as much belt as could be crammed on the spool to allow for the largest frame possible.

(in a new mold, I would suggest moving to a larger diameter idler to give more space among other changes)

But I think the biggest problem isn’t this area, but simply that if you have all 4 belts extended and hit ‘retract all’ you need to try and feed in all 4 belts simultaneously, and you only have two hands to do so. This means that two belts are not under tension and being held straight, so they can get misaligned under gravity, leading to them feeding through at an angle and getting into the gear area.

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I was under the assumption that the belt was that long because it needed to be.

Either way the design allows the belt to interfere with the gears and get chewed up, if it didn’t allow for the belt to find its way to the gears then 4 or 2 hands wouldn’t matter. My theory is that the flange above and below capture the belt better and cover the idler gear more. It may not allow the belt to fall or get pulled into the gear as easily.

I totally agree that a solution that involves remolding is not the best option so early.

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Regarding the flange that goes between the gears and spool surface here is what the 3D printed piece could look like.

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I recall that the amount of belt supplied was increased to ‘as much as could fit’ (or words to that effect) to allow for the maximum possible frame size- but I have also seen comments about shortening the belts to avoid issues.

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Have there been confirmations that shortening the belt has solved the issue completely, or have there been instances of similar failure even after shortening?

Really like the idea of extending the flanges for the current supplied belt length, top and bottom would be extended as the top and bottom parts are identical and sandwiched together.

Agree that shortening belts for a specific frame is likely the best solution for the hardware we have in hand. Has anyone done the math on necessary belt length for an 8x12 frame? Should be pretty simple.

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I was under the assumption that the belt was that long because it needed to be.

the provided belt is 14.5 ft long, a 11 ft belt would work for a 8x10 frame

Either way the design allows the belt to interfere with the gears and get
chewed up, if it didn’t allow for the belt to find its way to the gears then 4
or 2 hands wouldn’t matter.

slack in the belt allows them to get chewed up, I don’t think it’s because it
overflows the spool, I think the problem happens well before that point.

I think the most damage is happening as it goes between the two metal gears, not
the metal gear and the plastic spool.

My theory is that the flange above and below capture the belt better and cover
the idler gear more. It may not allow the belt to fall or get pulled into the
gear as easily.

Right, but per the image, you are extending a disk in the middle of the spool
(above the plastic gear teeth), at the top of the spool (where it’s currently
open) and at the bottom of the spool (the bottom of the teeth). It’s this last
one that is impacting the arm that I’m questioning. (I may be misunderstanding
what I’m looking at)

David Lang

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Vassilios Bletsos wrote:

Have there been confirmations that shortening the belt has solved the issue
completely, or have there been instances of similar failure even after
shortening?

I have not looked at all pictures of the chewed up belts, but I believe some of
them have been chewed far from the end (if it was only happening at the end,
then cutting off the damaged part would be all that’s needed)

David Lang

(I read most messages in a text-only mail client)

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Won’t the printable gear cover help with the chewed belts? Isn’t that its intention?

Scott wrote:

Won’t the printable gear cover help with the chewed belts? Isn’t that its intention?

That is the intent.

David Lang

Since this is “A Belts Life” thread I wanted to share that milling XPS, arcrylic, polycarbonate always results in chips that are super electrostatically charged and they stick to everything…A belt’s life may need to pass through a compressed air stream to blast particles from getting wound into the gear spindle assembly…

Can someone comment on the intent of the extend function. Do we expect each arm to be able to feed/push a given length of belt out of the arm with no human intervention? Or are we OK with always having human intervention?

That hopefully is handled through the vaccum/dust collection system. I would say if its getting out and up by the arms something would have to be tweaked.

Vassilios Bletsos wrote:

Can someone comment on the intent of the extend function. Do we expect each
arm to be able to feed/push a given length of belt out of the arm with no
human intervention? Or are we OK with always having human intervention?

you cannot push a belt, so it will always require a human putting tension on the
belt to extend them.

David Lang

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