if using 12ā/3.6m (141.7") 6 sticks + 1 10ā stick
full stick for the top beam (the extra couple of feet improves the chain angle)
91+24+24
82+24+20+12+3.5 x2
72+45+10+3.5+3.5 x2 (14" left, try to have a factory end on the 71" and 10" pieces)
60+60 (only 10ā needed)
assembly
assemble and square 2x 72" legs, 2x 82" crosspieces, 4x 3.5" blocks, 2x 45" verticals
a. add 24" diagonal braces
b. add 20" āwingsā
place extra 2x4 under the frame, attach 2x 24" rear kickers square to frame, touching the ground (1.5" past the frame)
tilt upright, resting the rear kickers on two thicknesses of 2x4 (use 10" and 10" pieces for this, the kicker will be 3" above the ground)
attach rear legs (with 3.5" spacers) to the front legs and rear kickers, resting on the ground
attach 12" pieces to the bottom wings
attach 10" pieces to the top of the legs (if you have factory ends, it makes attaching them square easier)
attach top beam flush to the front of the 10" pieces
@dlang
Looks great! Can you add a column to your table that names the parts say A.1, G.3, K.5 etc. etc. this will allow easy integration with the written instructions?
P.s. I have bought an imperial tape measure for kicks.
You could make the back legs longer, and put the support of the top beam between the back and the front leg. I donāt know if it is necesarry, but it is an easy way to make it stronger.
I think you could build the entire thing (except for the stretchy string wings) flat on the ground if you used bolts to connect the top beam support arm to the front leg. You could strap it tight when collapsed, move it, and then set it back up easily.
And if you wanted an adjustable top beam, you could add another brace and holes between themā¦ just pick which set of holes fits the best for the workpiece. Just have to make sure that you build it so you can meet a minimum extension length
The top beam and sled are not that heavy, they max out in the 50 pound range.
Since they are only moved forward ~6 inches (10 inch boards), a simple
flat-to-flat connection should be good enough.
I wouldnāt do the top beam supports like this, you want to make them flush with
the top of the legs when at the 90 degree angle. Iād be worried that they would
get mounted unevenly the way you show it.
Similarly, the bottom kickers need to stick out ājust enoughā (1-1.5" to hold
the wasteboard and edge of the workpiece), and you want the top of them to be
at exactly the same height, so I would not attach them flat
thinking about aligning the kickers, the current design puts the top of them at
10", if we put 1x 2x4 on edge, and 2x 2x4 flat, you can line them up with the
bottom of the legs to get them in the right place. Another (and possibly better)
way would be to use one of the 60" rear legs + a flat 2x4 (1.5") and reference
against the top (factory) edge of the leg. Use the same leg to set both sides,
and you will have the kickers parallel to the top beam.
you can attach the bottom wings with it flat, because the rear legs can pivot on
their bolts, so you can pivot them out of the way.
My thought was that you could accurately drill the bolt holes in the 2x4s first and then assemble. maybe Iām wrong, but I think you might be able to drill the holes more precisely than lining up the wood and screwing it together. Drilling could be aided through the use of a template.
Just adding my gratitude to this thread! I donāt have anything technical to add. I decided to stop cutting out parts for my original stock frame and will opt to build whatever comes out of this (though Iām dangerously close to just building @dlangās Alternate 2 cause I wanna get on with cutting some real projects!) . I simultaneously canāt wait for you to come up with a new official stock frame AND donāt want you to be rushed. So, thank you all for the hard work youāre doing here!!
Thinking about a āno measurement assemblyā process (i.e., you need to measure
and cut your pieces accurately, but once you have done that, you can put away
the tape measure to assemble the machine (except for squaring it, which can be
done with a piece of string).
To do this, I make use of the lengths that have been cut and tetris skills to
make things the right length
to keep everything square, you want to have a factory end on the 72" front legs,
one of the 60" back legs, the 10" top beam supports, and two of the 24" pieces
for the rear kickers (Iāll post a revised cut-list to show this grouping,
probably graphically)
when fastening with glue and screws, the main purpose of the screws is to hold
everything together while the glue dries, but they also provide a backup if the
glue fails. āreal woodworkersā can flatten/sand the surfaces and glue and clamp
instead of screwing and end up with a good, strong joint. Normal people should
leave screws in place
@madgrizzle, you make good diagrams, can you diagram each step? (the diagrams are
likely to be easier for people to understand than my pedantic text)
This is ordered to keep things as small as possible as long as possible so that
most of the work can be done on a bench/table
attach kickers to front legs
a. take a 60" rear leg and clamp it to the side of a front leg with factory
ends together and flush.
b. use spacer blocks under the combined legs to lift them 1.5" off the ground
c. put a spacer block narrow side against the bottom of the 60" piece
d. position the kicker against the ground and the spacer block (on what will
be the outside of the front leg, so one on the left and the other on the right).
Check that it is square and fasten it in place with glue and screws. (checking
that it is square can be resting the factory end against the ground)
DANGER: This is one of two places in the build where the angles and distances
are critical. Make sure that the kickers are as square to the front legs as you
can make them. Use the same pieces of wood as spacers for attaching the kicker
to each of the front legs.
attach the front legs to the rear legs
a. position the rear leg next to the front leg, with the bottoms of the legs
even.
b. place a block between the front and back legs at the top of the back leg
c. glue and screw the block to the front leg.
d. drill through the back leg and use a lag bolt to attach it to the block
(or optionally drill through all three and use a through bolt)
attach the chain support wings.
a. lift the rear leg and place a 20" wing against the top of the rear kicker.
you may want to put a block under the outside end of the wing to keep the leg
from tilting the wing.
b. place a block on the inside of the front leg (away from the back leg) end
grain facing front/back. use another block as a spacer to position the block
1.5" (thin dimension of a 2x4) up from the top of the kicker. Only half the
block will be available for the wing to rest against
c. fasten the block in place (glue and screws).
d. fasten the wing to the leg (glue and screws). while it is tempting to
fasten to the block as well, going into the end-grain provides very little
strength
DANGER: make sure the block does not slip and extend forward of the front
leg, with the kicker sticking forward of the leg, and the rear leg at an angle,
you have two things sticking forward, that can lift the front surface of the
front leg off the ground
position the top cross-member block
a. take one of the 45" verticals and set it against the block supporting the
wing (make the bottom of the vertical even with the bottom of the block), clamp
in place.
b. position a block between the front leg and the top of the vertical, even
with the top of the vertical, with the grain running front/back
c. swing the back leg out of the way to get access to screws the block in
place from the outside of the leg (otherwise you have to remove the vertical to
drive the screws)
d. glue and screw the block to the front leg.
DANGER: make sure the block does not slip and extend forward of the front
leg, with the kicker sticking forward of the leg, and the rear leg at an angle,
you have two things sticking forward, that can lift the front surface of the
front leg off the ground
angle the rear legs
a. pivot the rear legs so that the edge of the leg and the bottom corner of
the rear kicker line up, the top edge of the kicker will extend slightly beyond
the rear leg
b. glue and screw in place)
c. remove the bolt joining the legs (step 2d) to glue and screw that joint
together.
connect the front legs with cross-members
a. attach one 82" cross-member across the top of the top blocks attached to
the front legs, glue and screw into the block
b. attach the other 82" cross-member across the bottom of the bottom blocks,
if you did step 3b correctly, the bottom of the cross-member will be even with
the top of the kicker (so you can position blocks/tabs under the cross-member and
they will be in line with the part of the kicker that extends forward)
DANGER: make sure the cross-members doe not slip and extend forward of the
front leg, with the kicker sticking forward of the leg, and the rear leg at an
angle, you have two things sticking forward, that can lift the front surface of
the front leg off the ground
connect the verticals to the cross-members
a. use the 24" diagonal brace pieces as spacers to position the verticals in
from the blocks.
b. glue and screw
NOTE: this is fastening into the end grain of the verticals, which is very
weak, but these do not have much force against them (they just support the
workpiece/waste-board) so we can get away with this. Optionally cut 4 more blocks
and use them in the corners.
square the frame
a. use a string or tape measure (requires an assistant), check that the
diagonal distances between the corners of the cross-members are the same. If they
are not, rack the frame until they match (push on the corners with the longest
distance to distort the shape)
b. glue/screw the 24" diagonal braces across the back of the frame to hold
the frame in the right shape.
stand up the frame
attach the chain guide arms
a. line the 12" pieces up with the top, outside corners of the wings and
glue/screw them onto the wings. The placement of these is not critical
attach the top beam arms
a. square up the 10" top beam arms against the top of the legs.
b. glue and screw in place
DANGER: This is the second place in the build where the angles and
distances are critical. Make sure that the arms are as square to the front legs
as you can make them, and that the edges (top AND back) are flush.
prepare the top beam
a. attach the motor mounts to the outer edges of the top edge of the top beam
b. drill through the long dimension of the top beam for the bolts to hold it
to the top beam arms (mounted in step 10). These holes should be ~80.5 inches
apart, but since this will vary if cross-member lengths are slightly off or
joints are not tight, check against the completed frame.
mount the top beam
a. attach the top beam flush with the front of the top beam arms.
OPTION: Unistrut top beam
Unistrut is available from electrical supply stores, and most places that
sell construction material for commercial buildings (in the US, Home Depot and
Lowes carry it, but not always in stock). It is a 1 5/8 (41mm) channel that is
designed to hang things from easily. It is available with holes already in it
and will be a little stiffer than stick lumber and will not distort with
humidity changes.
OPTION: Adjustable thickness machine.
The stock machine can handle material up to about 1" thick. If you are
going to work with material thicker than this, replace the top beam arms with
12" long lengths of unistrut and you can then adjust the distance that the
motors are from the face of the machine. cut blocks to fasten to the top of the
unistrut arms, position these so the front edge of the block is 2.5" out from
the front of the legs. Adjust the top bar position so that the space between the
top beam and the spacer matches the thickness of your waste-board and material
being cut.
OPTION: Folding machine
In steps 1d and 5b bolt instead of glue/screw and skip step 5c. The 1d
bolt will have to be removed to fold the machine, so you must use a hex-head
through bolt there, but the other to are pivot joints and can use a lag bolt.
OPTION: Feet
After step 8 you can scribe the legs to the floor and cut them so they are
flat and add leveling feet or casters. If you just cut them flat, you are giving
up little bit of clearance for the bricks/dust hose to clear the floor.
edited to add quote so you can see what Iām replying to.
possibly, a bolt and swivel approach adds a new variable (how straight is your
hole?). It would be good to have someone try both (ideally someone without a lot
of experience)
I donāt think you gain a lot by attaching the top beam supports while flat, they
arenāt so high up that itās hard to work on (in fact, for me they are probably
easier to attach at head height than at ground level )
for what itās worth, Iām going to be building the alternate 2 design (possibly
with detachable chain guide wings) because I will have to move it out of my
garage to use it, and so having it fold and roll on the two large castors will
work FAR better for me than the new design.
There is value in setting up the top beam and top beam supports while the machine is on itās face, but that makes it harder to later attach the top beam supports at the right angle (because you have the weight of the top beam when you are trying to square up the supports)
Iām thinking that we should move step 12 up to before step 9, clamp the top beam supports against the top of the legs (non-factory ends of the supports flush with the top of the legs), prepare the top beam (and possibly fasten it to the supports and then remove it to make attaching it later easier as there are already holes in place) then remove the clamps and do everything else as-is.
Iām not very good at perspective drawingsā¦ I can easily do fronts, tops, bottoms, etc. But 3D perspective is not my forte and Iām afraid that might be needed for the instructions. And also, Iām having a bit of a time understanding the instructions (i.e., I probably need drawings to understand so I can make the drawings )
most of this can be done like the ones you did a few posts ago.
why donāt you start working through them and call me if needed (Iāll PM you my phone number)
With onshape, I can easily do the perspective output, but Iām not sure I can do a partial machine easily (and doing things where I move parts is bad because moving them back gets āfiddleyā
Step 1. ā¦ Iāll try to work on it some and call you if I need help. When Iām home, the kids want me to play with them, so itāll be hit and miss for a while.
ā¦ Iāll try to work on it some and call you if I need help. When Iām home, the kids want me to play with them, so itāll be hit and miss for a while.
