I deleted the image in my PC and will try downloading another copy. Last night I left pi on all night long hoping maybe I wasn’t waiting long enough and woke to the same commands froze on the screen. Thank you very much for your help. I’ll be sure to let you know when I get it. There would probably be a few people like me who would be willing to pay for an sd card with this preloaded and tested. I had no idea the raspberry imager would write over the NOOBS anyways or I wouldn’t have purchased one with NOOBS. As it turned out the NOOBS didn’t work and I had to do it myself, and the card only cost me $22 so I wasn’t concerned. By the way, I see in your profile your from MN? I moved to Idaho in 2020 from Lakeville. Used to work for Xcel Energy.
When the text comes up and stops look at the lines for the ip address. It is a text only display and will work without a display. You can use a cell phone or a computer on the same wifi to connect to it.
I have been reading through several old topics on this subject and I think the problem is that I’m using buster lite. I have a monitor for my Rpi along with a keyboard and a mouse. Should I be using a “full” version of webcontrol buster so that my Rpi retains the home page/windows type GUI with internet, etc?
I needed some positive energy so I spent about 45 minutes and installed the firmware on my arduino and webcontrol on my laptop and sure enough, the stepper motors responded to the test button in webcontrol. So if this whole Raspberry pi deal turns out to be too geeky, at least I have a working platform, but I would much rather get the Rpi working.
@Orob, hope you don’t mind me jumping in here. I think I see what is going on.
That all depends on your skill-set. The truth is, once you get the Pi up and running with WebControl you won’t need to mess with it that much except maybe to shut it down, reboot it, or copy some files off of it. You basicaly have three options going forward:
-
Burn the Raspberry Pi OS Lite (Buster - lite). This is a good choice if you wan to run the WebControl web server because it runs remarkebly fast becasue the system resources are pretty low. It will require you to become familiar with the command line interface though which can be a bit daunting if you have never used one before. You will need to install Web Control seperately after burning the OS image to the SD card.
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Burn the Raspberry Pi OS with desktop (Buster “Full”). This will give you a GUI desktop environment that will make it easier for you to administer the PI but at the expense of performance becasue now the Pi has to run a web server for WebControl AND run a desktop. If you plan on accessing the WebControl web server from another client (like a laptop) then this shouldn’t be a problem. You will need to install Web Control seperately after burning the OS image to the SD card.
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Burn the “2020-02-13-webcontrolcnc-buster-lite-0.1.1” file that you downloaded to the SD card. This file is a pre-configured Raspberry Pi image that contains the Buster - lite operating system AND WebControl. You would burn this to your SD card using the RasPi imager software (like options #1 & #2 above) and the result would be a RaspberryPI OS (Buster - lite) with WebControl installed. It WILL be a command line only interface (no desktop). It will also be the quickest method for getting your RasPI up and running with WebControl. Again, you will have to learn to navigate a Command Line Interface though.
In any of the above cases you will still need to configure some basic parameters (including setting up your networking configuration).
ALSO NOTE: The file that I mentioned in #3 above is not the file you would use to install WebControl seperately (in options #1 & #2). It is to ONLY be used for option #3. Installing Web Control seperately for #1 or #2 requires a different process. The procedure for installing WebControl seperately DOES NOT involve using the RasPI imager. It involves a seperate series of commands/tasks. It’s not like clicking on an executable in windows. It’s not complicated, just differnet.
If this was me, I would install the “RaspberryPI OS with desktop” and then install WebControl seperately (option #2 above). Having a desktop environment while you are trying to learn a new platform may be easier for you until you get more comfortable with the CLI. Just make sure you download the latest build from the Raspberry PI Foundation. You want the version with desktop but NOT the one with additional software. Once you get the OS imaged to the SD card and the PI operating normaly, then you can takle installing Web Control seperately.
So I loaded this. I believe it is the latest as it has 1/28 date on it.
OK, I’m at this step now. I’m not sure which file to use or how to install it separately since the imager will overwrite the sd card…
Another question I have is, how exactly does the PI and laptop physically connect and what are each doing in the scenario you describe below? I had my laptop connected to my arduino and it operated the motors when I did a motor test in WC. What purpose does the PI play if I use the laptop too? My understanding is I create a CAD file (laptop), convert it to CAM (laptop), then load the file in WC. This is probably a second question, but how do I get a file to the PI’s WC that I created on my laptop? I was thinking that I could use a usb memory stick but is this what you mean when you refer to “another client (like a laptop)”. Your probably getting the drift that some of these computer terms are throwing me.
Thanks, and I’m sorry for being such a computer dummy.
Jerry
to get the file to the pi, you can upload it via the webcontrol interface (some
people have also setup a shared drive that you can access from the PC, but
that’s more work to do when starting from scratch the way you are)
in your old system, the software on the PC was feeding the gcode file to the
arduino a line at a time via USB, in the new setup, the Pi is taking over that
job. This means that you can use multiple devices (say a phone as a mobile
controller) to talk to the webcontrol software on the Pi
you need to be able to talk to the pi over the network (can be wired or wireless
network)
you can run webcontrol on your laptop if you want. Webcontrol was written
because the prior control software (Ground Control) was out of date and having
problems upgrading due to changes in the graphics library it uses. Web Control
offloads the graphics to your browser, making it much simpler. This has the
happy side effect of allowing you to use multiple devices at the same time.
For example, you mention doing a motor test, you can have a PC somewhere that
you use for your heavy CAD work, and then use another one (or a phone) near the
machine to do the motor test and turn the motors to get a sprocket tooth to the
12 o’clock position (this is much easier to do when you can be right next to the
motor that’s moving with your phone than even a few feet away with a laptop)
David Lang
So to add a little bit of confusion, the RasPI Foundation released the new Debian Linux Bullseye version of RasPi OS. Not an issue, you installed the latest and greatest RaspiOS. Where we were calling it “Buster” before, we are now calling it “Bullseye”. Once you have this installed you should have gone through the process of configuring things like your wireless networking and localization options. Have you done this yet?
Since you now have WebControl running on your laptop, you could just continue to keep using this setup going forward. Connect the laptop to the Arduino like you have and start using the Maslow. You really don’t need the Pi if this is the case. You had expressed an interest in trying to get it funtioning and using it so I offered up your options for doing so. To clarify you can use WebControl running on your laptop or you can use WebControl running on the PI.
The benefit of running WebControl on your Pi is that WebControl runs as a web service. This means that you will be able to use almost any device with a modern web browser as a control device. PC, laptop, mobile devices, etc… this gives you the freedom of having wireless (or even wired if you want) control over your maslow across multiple devices. You are not teathered to the Maslow’s Arduino. The Pi will be connected to the arduino via USB, but your control interface could really be anything with a browser that can connect to your network and access the WebControl server running on the Pi.
Yeah, you don’t need to apologize. Everyone, and I mean EVERYONE has been here before.
Yes I did. I set it up in the hidden file on the imager. I verified the wifi connection by going on the internet. I’m tempted to just use the laptop but I’ve come this far, I think I need to conquer this.
I’m not able to work on this till probably tomorrow night. I really appreciate all the help and your patience. I think I will search for a youtube that might show how a mobile device can run this through the pi. That sounds really handy.
Hey thanks so much for continuing to help. It is really helpful to get different peoples help cause when I hear the same or similar thing from different people, things start to click for me. As for the webcontrol interface, where would I find this and is there a particular file i’m looking for? All I know is when I have removed the sd card and attempted to “add” webcontrol, it overwrote the OS. I’m assuming I get this from the location you mentioned via the PI and upload it similar to how you would a file on a PC?
To help you out on this point. Once you have the Pi OS on the SD card, you no longer need to remove the SD card unless you are going to install a prebuilt image that has both the OS with WC installed on it already. Think of it this way, the Pi is a computer. “Buster” or “Bullseye” is the OS (aka the “windows”) for the Pi. WebControl is an app/program that needs to be installed (like Office, or Google Chrome, or a PC game). So, since you stated above you have already loaded the OS in the Pi imager (with the wifi and other configurations taken care of), then what you need to do is plug a keyboard, mouse, and monitor into it and turn it on. I think you said you loaded a full version that has a desktop GUI (Graphic User Interface) that will look a lot like what you would see in a Windows Machine. from there, you can test internet connectivity with the Pi by opening up it’s internet browser and going to any website you want to go to. If that works, then you have internet connection.
As you are getting used to the Pi, search Youtube for how to use the RPi like a regular computer. I haven’t searched that myself, but I would bet there are plenty of videos on how to just navigate around and the general use of the Pi. From there, look to how to run commands from a terminal window. This will be needed to get WebControl installed and then set up as a Web Service as @jonatpridesleap mentioned. You can find those instructions here: WebControl Setup on Raspberry Pi
You can read through the beginning portion of it, but you have done most of that already, so you’ll want to pick up about a third of the way down here:
That should get you moving in the right direction to get it up and going.
edit: If you want to start over from scratch and go the pre-built route, another way to do that is to follow this post here: How Do I Install? Raspberry Pi and WebControl setup for complete beginners
I’m putting together some instructions on what to do next. I’ll report back.
Since you have a running system on your laptop, getting WebControl running on your Pi too is purely a learning exercise. However, going through with this is a good way to learn more about Pi, Linux and computer literacy in general.
First, open a terminal window. If you are on the Raspberry Pi desktop, look for an icon on the desktop (upper left) that shows what looks like a small computer screen with a >_ symbol in it and a black background. When you open this up you may see some characters followed by a blinking cursor. This is known as the Command Line Interface (CLI).
Going forward, I will try to explain what the commands are and what they do in italics. Don’t type these statements, they are there for you information. Also, don’t type the “$” symbol. It is there to represent the user prompt that you will see in the CLI. Just type everything after it. If you are working on the Pi while doing this then you should be able to copy and paste the commands below into the CLI.
Type (or copy) the following commands. Hit enter after every line:
$ cd ~
The “cd” command is the command to change directory. The tilde (~) means “HOME Directory”. What you are doing here is changing the current working directory to the HOME directory of the Linux user.
$ mkdir webcontrol
The “mkdir” command is the Linux command to make a new directory.
$ cd webcontrol
This command will change the directory to the webcontrol directory you just created.
$ wget https://github.com/webcontrolcnc/webcontrol/releases/download/v0.94/webcontrol-0.94-rpi-singledirectory.tar.gz
“wget” is a linux command used to copy and retrieve a file from some remote source. It can be used in many different variations and locations but in this case you are telling Linux to go to a particualr website, navigate down through a file structure, and copy the specific file you need to install WebControl. In this case it’s the “webcontrol-0.94-rpi-singledirectory.tar.gz” file. The “.tar.gz” file extension means the file an archive that is also compressed.
$ ls -l
The “ls -l” command will list the contents of the current working directory. You should now see the “webcontrol-0.94-rpi-singledirectory.tar.gz” file listed in the directory.
$ tar -zxvf webcontrol-0.94-rpi-singledirectory.tar.gz
This command will decompress and expand the archive file. It’s similar to un-zipping a file in Windows. Once it completes, it should contain all of the files needed to run WebControl. At this point WebControl is effectively “installed”
$ ./webcontrol
This command will start the WebControl web server. It is telling Linux to “run” the WebControl startup script.
After it starts, WebControl should be accessible by any internet browser on any computer connected to the same network that your Pi is connected to. You should be able access the main WebControl web page by typing in the correct ip address of your Pi followed by the port number in the address bar of your browser.
For example, to access my WebControl web page I type the following into my browser’s address bar The ip address for your Pi will probably be different:
http://192.168.10.118:5000/
You should be greeted with the main WebControl web page. If you have connected your Pi to the Maslow’s Arduino (via USB), you should be able to configure the connection to it from within the WebControl interface and verify that you can actualy control your Maslow.
ONE CAVEAT
When you typed ./webcontrol, you started the web server. Right now, if you were to reboot the RasPi, you will have to manualy re-start the service. You will need to do this EVERY time you shutdown or reboot the Pi. There is a way to set webcontrol to autostart at start-up so you don’t have to manualy do it but I would save that for the next step.
@jonatpridesleap Well done!!
One caveat is that in the commands you have listed, you do not need to type the “$” as it should just be there at the beginning of the line. just make sure what you type matches what @jonatpridesleap has for the line. (If I am wrong, please let me know and then slap me with a rather large trout, and I’ll delete this post!!)
I made a note about this at the beginning but keep your post up because it cant be said enough and visibility is good.
I’m getting pretty excited to get going on this. You guys (everyone who have helped here) are doing a great job in capturing the “how to” of this. I hope this can be captured for everyone in the future. I’ll keep you updated as I go. Thank you so much!
one thing that really helps is when someone who is new and struggles with it
figures it out, and then writes up what they wish they had been told. Too many
of us are too familiar with things and make assumptions, even when we are
explicitly trying not to.
I’ve heard that in the heydays of Heathkit, they only allowed someone to build
2-3 kits before they were no longer consideredd new enough to properly test the
instructions and find problems, after that they were experienced enough that
they ‘filled in the blanks’ and missed things that would confuse new people.
David Lang
Exactly!
I will be sure to do that. I have a lot of comments already but I will hold off till I get it.
I actually retired early last year from a mechanical maintenance instructor position at a major electric and gas utility. I worked in both nuclear and the fossil side. A lot of what I did involved writing procedures on tasks which were infrequently performed and I understand that you have to assume the trainee knows little to nothing. I’ll be sure to provide that feedback.
Realizing that I will need to learn a bit of command line code first, I will read up on that before I proceed but when itis time to get the webcontrol file, I will be searching all the comments above regarding where the file is and which one? That was actually a topic I started about 3 weeks ago when I was naive and thought I could just download it like a PC, but to be honest, I still am unclear as to which file is the correct one for the method I am undertaking, which is to add the program to my Pi with the OS already installed, not to remove and reflash the drive. It was very helpful to have the 3 options laid out and explainded by @jonatpridesleap in this thread. Once I read that, things others had said made more sense to me.
I guess I will give this bit of insight as to what would be helpful. Somewhere I found a topic where a member wrote out an excellent flow chart if you would, using words, as to how the entire computer system works from CAD to CAM to WC to the servo motors. I now know there are multiple paths and there are multiple programs, some of which are free. For me, a visual flow chart would be awesome and rather than having it in this forum, I think it would have been really helpful if it was a tab on the Maslow CNC page. The reason I say this is that I never thought to get into this forum until after I had already ordered my kit. Terms like “arduino”, “motor shield”, “DUE”, were also a bit perplexing.
Jerry
LMAO!!!
I’m stealing this line forevermore!
Jerry
GENIUS!!! I got it! Oh the humanity!
Now that I have graduated to apprentice geek, I am ready for the instructions to have it auto-start.
I’ll be honest, the toughest thing for me as a newbie in all this is the terminology. What helped me the most was your description of the CLI. I had opened this several times but had no idea what it was. Also the $ information was helpful as is the description of what each line did. For others I would recommend opening this page of instructions on the Rpi and highlighting them, then right click to copy, then you need to reopen the CLI which will minimize to the top of the screen and right click when you put the cursor over the square to the right of the $ and click paste, then enter. I almost peed my pants watching it do its thing! This is not hard at all but extremely intimidating… I had been putting this off all day and when I realized it was constantly nagging at me as I was working on other things, I had to just suck it up and do it.
If these instructions you made were combined with the first part where you told me how to get the most recent OS (that part though would benefit from adding the instructions from @Orob where he explained how to open the super top secret window and set your wifi, etc) The only thing I was confused on with that part however was there was no mention of what settings the last page should be? I forget what the options were but my imager had the 2nd and 3rd boxes checked. I think I unchecked them. I hope this isn’t going to be a problem going forward.
I’m seriously stoked right now. You have no idea!
I look forward to sharing my frame as I build it. All I know is it will probably be made of steel or aluminum…probably steel since my tig welder doesn’t have high frequency for aluminum and I don’t like wire feed aluminum welds as they can be quite ugly without wasting a ton of time practicing.
Have a great day guys!
Jerry